Deism

My New Spiritual Home

Published on January 19, 2006 By JillUser In Religion

I humbly admit that until introduced to the term "Deism" by Myrrander, I had never heard of it. When Myr set forth that I was deist rather than agnostic, I looked into it and indeed he was right. Friends had always referred to me as agnostic so I accepted that term for lack of knowing a more fitting term.

I believe there is a God in the sense that there is a creator. I don't believe there is an organized religion out there that has it right where God is concerned. I always found organized religions to be too restrictive and circular in thinking. Whenever anyone says they know what God wants, I cringe. I believe God is far too complex for us to "know" anything about.

Agnostic wasn't really a bad fit either since I do believe you can neither prove nor disprove the existance of God. I do know that not all of the organized religions can be right and it is far too exclusive for only one of them to be right. Say christians have it right. What happens to the devoted Jews, muslims, hindus, etc? Is God only choosing some of the population to enlighten? That doesn't jive with me.

I have noticed in my experience that the most devoutly religious people tend to live the most miserable lives. I credit this to the fact that if they didn't believe there would be something better for them in the next life, they wouldn't be able to go on each day of this one.

People say that everything happens for a reason and only God knows the greater purpose. I don't buy that either. Sometimes terrible things happen to wonderful people and there is no reason.

If you have your own opinions regarding things that I have brought up, please share them. However, PLEASE do not come on here and quote scripture or preach to me the error of my ways. I respect the fact that other people have different beliefs than my own and am interested in how they feel about it but I am done with being told why I am wrong in mine and where in the bible it says I'm wrong. You can't convince me the bible is God's word by quoting the bible. That is the circular reasoning that turns me off from organized religion.

So please come here, tell me what you believe, don't believe, or what religion you have faith in but don't preach. I am so done with that that I will remove scripture quotes and ban you.

Comments (Page 4)

gluasad

on Jan 21, 2006

"Do not believe in anything simply because you have heard it. Do not believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumoured by many. Do not believe in anything because it is found written in your religious books. Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of your teachers and elders. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations. But after observation and analysis, when you find anything that agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it."

-Siddhartha Gautama (The Buddha), 563-483 B.C.

JillUser

on Jan 21, 2006

I couldn't agee with you more LW!

JillUser

on Jan 21, 2006

gluasad, that is exactly why Budhism is a philosophy and not a religion. Buddha just says that you should think before you leap. I totally agree with that philosophy. Thanks for the great quote!

simply me

on Jan 22, 2006

interesting

Draginol

on Jan 22, 2006

I've tended to look at religion much the same as I look at a Star Trek convention. You have a bunch of people who are really into their story.

From an outside point of view, there's not that much difference between hard-core fans of a sci-fi show and religious people.

In many respects, Christianity was one of the first fan clubs. But instead of them asking panelists (priests) "Remember in Episode 1S15A where Captain Piquard meets the Dralak? How could he know the Dralak were really people from the future?" you get "Remember in Leviticus 1:15 where we're not allowed to sell slaves to foreigners? Does that count Canadians?"

AndyBaker

on Jan 22, 2006

'At the Meuzzin's call for prayer
The kneeling faithful thronged the square;
Amid a monastery's weeds,
An old Franciscan told his beads,
While on Pushkara's lofty height
A dark priest chanted Brahma's might,
While to the synagogue there came
A Jew, to praise Jehovah's Name.
The One Great God looked down and smiled
And counted each His loving child;
For Turk and Brahmin, monk and Jew
All loved Him through the gods they knew.’

That’s a great poem Little Whip. I couldn’t agree more. I believe that when we put our religious revelations together in a big pot, then rather than finding a melly of contradictions, we find a lot of jigsaw pieces which, when put together in the right way, can reveal the full picture of Ultimate Reality.

if I had to pick any system of belief to follow, it would probably be Taoism

Taoism is fantastic, Myrrander. Its philosophical ideas are laden with great wisdom. The Tao Te Ching, written abouty 500 BC, taught that the divinity within us, or the soul, already sees and plans the first 13 years of its upcoming earth life. I think that’s a profound and original teaching, as far as our world's traditional revelations go. The good thing about Taoism is that it’s not a religion. It’s more of a philosophical or spiritual idea, with no dogma or regulations attached to it.

I've tended to look at religion much the same as I look at a Star Trek convention. You have a bunch of people who are really into their story.
From an outside point of view, there's not that much difference between hard-core fans of a sci-fi show and religious people.
In many respects, Christianity was one of the first fan clubs. But instead of them asking panelists (priests) "Remember in Episode 1S15A where Captain Piquard meets the Dralak? How could he know the Dralak were really people from the future?" you get "Remember in Leviticus 1:15 where we're not allowed to sell slaves to foreigners? Does that count Canadians?"

Interesting analogy, Draginol. It would ring true for some, but not for everyone.

JillUser

on Jan 22, 2006

I'm sure christians are going to love being compared to Trekkies

But for those who don't believe the Bible is the word of God, it does seem like merely a bunch of people obsessed with a book. It is understandable if one does believe the book to be the word of God that that person want to learn everything about it they can. But that is exactly why I tire of scripture quoting fests. It means little more to me than someone saying "In Epsisode 28, Kirk ........" Those fests are also totally exclusive because anyone who isn't christian is out of the loop.

That is why I requested people only talk about what their belief is and how they feel about it rather than preaching and quoting which tends to turn people away unless they have already bought what is being preached and quoted. As a result, people have felt welcome to come and talk about a wide number of religions and philosophies and I have enjoyed every comment!

AndySocial

on Jan 22, 2006

You can neither prove nor disprove the existence of God, this is true. Of course, you can neither prove nor disprove the existence of any number of beings - leprechauns, the Easter Bunny, and the flying spaghetti monster all come to mind. Being unable to disprove the existence of something is not the same as saying there is doubt over its existence. We cannot, with 100 percent certainty, prove that there is not a teacup orbiting the planet Mars, but we will go ahead and operate as if there is not such a teacup - there is no evidence at all that it exists.

SO, to say that something cannot be disproven is nothing. To say that there is ambiguous evidence is something. Many people have spent years pointing to evidence they claim implies or proves the existence of a deity. Since none of that evidence has reached anything close to the level of proof, it remains a matter of faith and hypothesis.

AndySocial likes to muddy the waters where possible.

Dr Guy

on Jan 22, 2006

I've tended to look at religion much the same as I look at a Star Trek convention. You have a bunch of people who are really into their story.

Interesting, while I love Star Trek, I have always found them to be Anti-Theism. NOt rabidly so, but remember the one with the Utankans?

Dr Guy

on Jan 22, 2006

I'm sure christians are going to love being compared to Trekkies

We have been compared to worst! I find no insult in it!

AndyBaker

on Jan 22, 2006

We cannot, with 100 percent certainty, prove that there is not a teacup orbiting the planet Mars, but we will go ahead and operate as if there is not such a teacup - there is no evidence at all that it exists.

There's a difference between belief in a flying teacup and belief that life has transcendent purpose. Here, we’re talking about the nature of the Infinite and the Sustaining Reality of Being, not alien tea ware. There's a big difference.

MasonM

on Jan 22, 2006

Quite an interesting thread. While I tend to lean towards Christianity in a lot of respects, I also hold to some of the beliefs and teachings of many other schools of thought including Buddhism, Taoism, Essenes, Judaism, and the reverence for the spirits of the natural world held by most Native Americans.

I don't believe any one religion really has it all right simply because people are incapable of knowing any real details about the realm/universe/dimension/other reality in which God exists, let alone such a vastly different being as God.

I do believe that there is one who created this physical universe. I believe that this universe exists "inside of" a much larger universe the nature of which is most likely beyond our comprehension.

Some ideas are held by nearly all of the world's religions in some form or another. I believe these common ideas may come a tad closer to the truth of things, in some small way, than any single religion's over-all dogma.

Treat our fellow human beings with kindness and respect. Help each other. Do not lie to/about someone to cause them harm. Do no intentional harm to others. Protect those who can't protect themselves. Respect yourself. Do not hate.

I think all of the world's religions are glimpses into that which created us, just from different cultural perspectives. If everyone in every culture truly behaved according to their culture's base religious beliefs Earth would be a truly peaceful and happy little planet.

JillUser

on Jan 22, 2006

MasonM, I am unfamiliar with Essenes. Could you share a bit about it with me? I love hearing about all the different religious beliefs and philosophies.

MasonM

on Jan 22, 2006

The Essenes, or Nazareans, were an order of peoples who studied all of the known religions and were similar in philosophy to what later was known as Christians and Buddhists. Some believe that Jesus, John the Baptist, and Jesus' parents were among the order of the Essenes.

The order was unknown to modern people until the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls in 1946. They were a community of scholars and were widely known as physicians, craftsmen, and artisans.

These people in white were widely known in the ancient world. The Hebrews called them "The School of Prophets"; and, to the Egyptians, they were "The Healers, The Doctors". They had property in nearly all of the big cities; and, in Jerusalem, there was even a door that bore their name: the door of the Essenes.

At least that's a bit of what I have read about them.

The modern Essenes, a resurrection of the old order, believe that the scriptures as they exist in the modern Christian bible were actually altered by Rome to better fit the desires and ideas of Rome. The Essenes are vegetarians and abstain from alcohol.

A bit of googling can turn up much more detailed information. How much is actually historically factual and how much has been invented by the new Essenes is anyone's guess, but is some interesting reading anyway.

JillUser

on Jan 22, 2006

The modern Essenes, a resurrection of the old order, believe that the scriptures as they exist in the modern Christian bible were actually altered by Rome to better fit the desires and ideas of Rome

That is one of my problems with people who take the bible too literally. For one thing, it was written how many years after Jesus died? It was translated from language to language to language. Who knows how much got changed in translation alone! Then there were alterations made by societies and different points in history.

Thanks for the interesting info! I had never heard of the Essenes and it sounds like an interesting subject to learn more about.

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